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Blog Entry

Jays asked for Buchholz in exchange for Farrell

Posted on: November 25, 2011 1:28 pm
 


By C. Trent Rosecrans

How much is a manager worth?

If you're the Marlins, it's worth two minor-leaguers in exchange for Ozzie Guillen, a manager with a .524 winning percentage over eight years and a World Series title.

If you're the Blue Jays, you seem to think your manager with one year of experience and a .500 record is worth a 27-year old starter with an All-Star appearance under his belt. The Boston Red Sox, apparently, don't agree.

According to several reports, including one from the New York Times, the Red Sox passed when the Blue Jays asked for Clay Buchholz in return for John Farrell. And wisely so.

While some may get up in arms about this trade possibility (or, really, non-possibility when you think about it), it makes sense from both sides. It's part of doing business -- the Red Sox needed a new manager after getting rid of Terry Francona, and in Farrell, there was a known commodity inside the organization (Farrell had been the Red Sox pitching coach) with major-league managing experience. He was a perfect fit. Except, you know, for that part about him already having a job and being under contract for the next two years.

That's where the Blue Jays had leverage -- if the Red Sox wanted Farrell, they could have him for a price. Asking for Buchholz is probably as close to saying "no" as you can without saying that word -- the Blue Jays didn't want to give up their manager that they like just fine, so the price was high. If they had to get a new manager, that manager would love to have Buchholz in the rotation, that's for sure. 

While the Blue Jays seem to think their manager is worth quite a bit, the market tells us differently. So far this offseason, there's been a run this off-season on first-year managers. The Cubs, White Sox and Cardinals -- three marquee openings -- went to first-time managers, the White Sox hiring a guy who has never managed at any level. The market, it seems is saying experienced managers are not worth the money they command. If you have a Tony La Russa, it's fine to pay him a lot. But if you don't, go out and storm the Wal-Mart for your next manager and get him at a discount.

Trades for a manager are rare -- as the Guillen trade was the first since the Rays sent Randy Winn and a minor-leaguer to Seattle for Lou Piniella in 2002. That one didn't pay immediate dividends, but there are at least two trades for managers that did seem to be worth the price. The Mets sent right-hander Bill Denehy to the Senators for manager Gil Hodges after the 1967 season and the Mets went on to win the 1969 World Series. The Pirates got their own World Series-winning manager in a trade, sending veteran catcher Manny Sanguillen to the A's for Chuck Tanner following the 1976 season. Tanner led the Pirates to the 1979 World Series title (with Sanguillen, who was traded back to the Pirates after the 1977 season).

It's hardly out of the question for Guillen -- or Farrell -- to lead their team to the World Series, but it's more likely Buchholz will contribute more value than any manager, so the Blue Jays were right to ask for Buchholz and the Red Sox were right to say no.

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Comments

Since: Nov 27, 2011
Posted on: November 27, 2011 8:10 pm
 

Jays asked for Buchholz in exchange for Farrell

MattLee, I don’t think you understand why people choose to not post their pictures of other pieces of personal information on these sites.  Its because with a simple search someone could find out way too much about a person.  For instance;

 

 

 

 

 

So before you say “No wonder you guys can't get a real woman” again maybe you should take into account that we can go look at your online dating profile where you’re 35 years old looking for a 20-24 year old girl. 





Since: Nov 27, 2011
Posted on: November 27, 2011 12:37 pm
 

Jays asked for Buchholz in exchange for Farrell

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Since: Sep 27, 2006
Posted on: November 27, 2011 10:53 am
 

Jays asked for Buchholz in exchange for Farrell

chewykablooie

You mean besides the point only losers and cowards won't show what they look like online? The moment I go to a site, if the person isn't showing what they look like but is talking crap it's obvious their a coward who wants to try and act like a bad ass. But only talks crap because they feel nothing can happen to them. Not hard to talk crap when you feel you can say what you want and nothing bad can happen, it's another thing to talk crap when people can see what you look like and know your name.

And to answer the other question. The reason my rating always goes back to superstar is because all my levels are high except for my value. I have a 98 connection rating. I have a 99 participation rating and a skill level of 89. My skill level is higher than the majority who argue with me and most who argue with me play more games on CBS than me. I play in 2 leagues on average a year. So clearly I know more than most who argue with me. If I didn't know anything my skill level would be low. The truth is I could easily be top 100 overall. But as long as I put people in their place and make them look bad I will always have a low value level because the losers who start crap with me end up reporting me when I make them look bad. If I sucked up to everyone and played nice my value would be at least 90 if not higher.

It's another reason I laugh at people who call me an idiot. Not only am I the only one willing to show what I look like but my skill level is higher as well. So you have a dumb coward calling someone smarter an idiot. That's just a hilarious combination.



Since: Sep 14, 2006
Posted on: November 27, 2011 10:39 am
 

Jays asked for Buchholz in exchange for Farrell

silly talk.  The Blue Jays did the right thing asking for a major leaguer in return for their manager. 



Since: Aug 7, 2008
Posted on: November 26, 2011 11:02 pm
 

Jays asked for Buchholz in exchange for Farrell

Actions like these continue to support the assumption that the Blue Jays are incompetent and are the laughingstock of the league. Canada deserves much better. Sadly, the Montreal Expos/Washington Nationals have shown more intelligence than the Blue Jays. And the Nationals have ran Strasburg's arm into the ground while the news regarding Bryce Harper is not much encouraging.



Since: Nov 20, 2008
Posted on: November 26, 2011 10:54 pm
 

Jays asked for Buchholz in exchange for Farrell

an actual cut and pasted quote from stevephoenix :"boy that's way you Canadians will always kiss are American ass's."
Anybody at all have any idea what language this might come from? It says here old stevie "do you want fries with that" pheonix wears a name tag at work....




Since: Nov 20, 2008
Posted on: November 26, 2011 10:51 pm
 

Jays asked for Buchholz in exchange for Farrell

Is there any chance at all stevephoenix doesn't have a mullet and a gut that would make sabathia green with envy?



Since: Feb 23, 2008
Posted on: November 26, 2011 10:05 pm
 

Jays asked for Buchholz in exchange for Farrell

Who cares what they look like?  Why is knowing that going to make any difference? It's not like you guys are going to meet up in a dark alley is it?  Try to have a thicker skin. If they are idiots, then how can they really insult you.



Since: Aug 7, 2008
Posted on: November 26, 2011 10:04 pm
 

Jays asked for Buchholz in exchange for Farrell

Boy are the Blue Jays & their Canadians fans stupid. Did you Canadians think that the Red Sox would give up one of their top young SP's for just a coach, boy that's way you Canadians will always kiss are American ass's.



Since: Sep 27, 2006
Posted on: November 26, 2011 9:32 pm
 

Jays asked for Buchholz in exchange for Farrell

Know what's truly funny? The ones who call me names like idiots are the ones who won't show people what they look like in real life. And you know if you found out what they looked like, they wouldn't post on here ever again.

So basically I have cowards calling me an idiot. Wow, I'm really hurt by guys on here who aren't even man enough to show what they look like. No wonder you guys can't get a real woman. Must be hard having hide behind a computer to talk crap.


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