Blog Entry

Santo among Hall of Fame's Golden Era candidates

Posted on: November 3, 2011 11:22 am
 
By C. Trent Rosecrans

Former Cubs third baseman Ron Santo is among eight former players and two former executives will be voted upon by the 16-member Golden Era Committee at the Winter Meetings and announced on Dec. 5.

On the list are Buzzie Bavasi, Ken Boyer, Charlie Finley, Gil Hodges, Jim Kaat, Minnie Minoso, Tony Oliva, Allie Reynolds and Luis Tiant.

The finalists are voted on by a 16-member board -- they are Hall of Famers Hank Aaron, Al Kaline, Ralph Kiner, Tommy Lasorda, Juan Marichal, Brooks Robinson, Don Sutton and Billy Williams; major league executives Paul Beeston (Blue Jays), Bill DeWitt (Cardinals), Rolan Hemond (Diamondbacks), Gene Michael (Yankees) and Al Rosen (retired); as well as media members Dick Kaegel (MLB.com), Jack O'Connell (BBWAA) and Dave Van Dyck (Chicago Tribune).

The Golden Era Committee currently uses a three-year cycle of consideration for managers, umpires, executives and long-retired players by era.

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Comments

Since: Nov 9, 2007
Posted on: November 4, 2011 2:24 pm
 

Santo among Hall of Fame's Golden Era candidates

You would be a michigan fan...



Since: Oct 26, 2006
Posted on: November 4, 2011 1:12 pm
 

Santo among Hall of Fame's Golden Era candidates

I can't believe that people are:  (a) making a case for Ron Santo getting into the Hall of Fame; (b) comparing him statistically to Brooks Robinson. 

It's not the Hall of Very Good, folks.  Did Brooks Robinson have great offensive numbers?  No.  BUT HE WAS A VACUUM CLEANER AT THIRD BASE.  He was known for his DEFENSE.  Just like a more recent inductee into the Hall, shortstop Ozzie Smith.  THAT is why he is there.  Saying that Santo should go because his offensive numbers are a little better than Robinson's is idiotic at best.  He was a .277 lifetime batter with 342 homers.  Not hall of fame numbers.  Defensively?  5 gold gloves.  Respectable.  But there is no "wow factor" for Santo that would make you say, "This guy is a hall of fame player."  NONE.  Robinson has that "wow factor" with his incredible defense.

And those that knock Robinson offensively?  .303 lifetime playoff hitter.  The man came through in the clutch.

And please don't start with the Bill Mazeroski comparisons next.  "Maz" is only in the Hall of Fame because of his 1960 World Series clinching home run.  That guy has NO BUSINESS being in the Hall of Fame.  And saying that Santo should go because Mazeroski is in would simply be another mistake by the Veterans Committee, and the standards for entry will simply continue to decline. 

Only place Santo deserves a plaque is at Wrigley Field.  Not Cooperstown material.  Great guy.  Solid player.  But in no way Hall of Fame material.  NOT EVEN CLOSE!



Since: Jul 19, 2011
Posted on: November 4, 2011 12:15 pm
 

Santo among Hall of Fame's Golden Era candidates

take a look at gary carter and his stats they arent even the best to be in the hall of fame,if you look at ted simmons stats there better and he isnt even in the hall,there is a problem. carter .262 batting average and only 2092 hits gimme a break thats not hall of fame stats bill buckner batted .289 and over 2700 hits and he is not in there either ron santo has more homers more rbi's and a better batting average why shouldnt he be in there 342 hr's .277 batting avg. and over 2200 hits. simmons batting avg is .285 and over 2400 hits 400 more then carter and 23 percentage pts better than carter, there is just to many flaws in who gets in and who doesnt it is one big joke.



Since: Sep 20, 2006
Posted on: November 3, 2011 4:15 pm
 

Santo among Hall of Fame's Golden Era candidates

Ron Santo was a GOOD player...might have been a great guy...but he was not a HOF player. The Hall of Fame isn't for good players, it's for the ALL-TIME greatest players.

Some of the comparisons here are baseless...Brooks Robinson was the best 3b of his day, and probably in the top 3 of all time. His batting average wasn't great, but he accumulated a lot of offensive stats over a long career, and he won plenty of awards. Tony Perez was one of the most consistent RBI producers and HR hitters of his day, even so, his stats are marginal for HOF, and they dwarf Santo's.


Ernie Banks, Billy Williams and Ferguson Jenkins were HOF players, and Santo wasn't in their class...I would compare Santo more to Mark Grace...another good player, but no HOF credentials.  


There are good reasons long losing teams don't produce many HOF players...and those same reasons are why they lost so much. Simple: Losing teams have fewer great players.    &nb
sp;   



Since: Nov 3, 2011
Posted on: November 3, 2011 3:24 pm
 

Santo among Hall of Fame's Golden Era candidates

The Santo crowd will keep this up until he gets in, deserving or not.  To be honest, there are worse players in the Hall of Fame, but is that really the standard they should shoot for?

He played on a Cubs team that already has three Hall of Famers (Banks, Jenkins and Williams) and they never won anything significant.  How many HOF players could an also-ran team support?

To compare him to Brooks Robinson with statistics alone is deceiving, at best.  Robinson was an AL MVP, All-Star MVP and World Series MVP, all in different years.  Santo was none of these.  And, although Robinson was known for his fielding more than his hitting, he led the American League one year in RBI.  Santo had some very good hitting years, but never once led his league in a significant hitting category.  (Wrigley Field is generous when it comes to helping hitters stats, and, just to make it better, they added the baskets on the outfield walls to make it more so.)
      
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Robinson also finished in the top 5 in AL MVP voting five times, was an 18 time All Star and won 16 consecutive Gold Gloves.  Santo can match none of those accomplishments.  Baseball is a team game, so rings are not so closely tied to an individual player.  That said, Robinson's Orioles won a couple of World Series and lost another two or three.

When comparing him to others on this Golden Era list, he and Gil Hodges are the most accomplished and most alike.  Hodges was a great fielder, his batting average and home run totals are about the same as Santo.  Hodges was second in HRs and RBIs in MLB during the decade of the 1950s.  He also managed the 1969 Miracle Mets to the World Series victory and won two World Series as a player with the Dodgers, while losing four or five.  All that being said, he never led the league in any one season in a significant batting category - just like Santo.  They were very comparable and should either both get in or neither get in.

(Another player that is indistinguishable from them is Tony Perez, who was never even in the discussion for a Gold Glove award and never led a significant hitting category, but his team and a weak field carried the day on his election.) 
   




Since: Mar 19, 2008
Posted on: November 3, 2011 2:24 pm
 

Santo among Hall of Fame's Golden Era candidates

Actually it is brilliant to compare Santo to Robinson, the played in the same era and guess what? That is what you use to determine hall worthiness! Too many people today try to compare players from 40 years ago with today's, wrong thing to do! Santo should have been in the hall, he just go screwed because even though he was on some good Cubs teams, most of them were bad. Santo deserves to be in the hall, period.



Since: Sep 18, 2007
Posted on: November 3, 2011 2:19 pm
 

Santo among Hall of Fame's Golden Era candidates

It is really too bad that Ron Santo did not go into the hall when he was alive.  While I am not a Cubs fan I truly appreciate his love for his team, I purchased the mlb.com package the last 5 years and loved listening to the Cubs broadcasts at work.  One of my favorite radio broadcasters.  Ron Santo embraced everything
that is good in baseball.  I love this game.



Since: Dec 7, 2006
Posted on: November 3, 2011 2:09 pm
 

Santo among Hall of Fame's Golden Era candidates

Equally brilliant to compare Santo and Robinson.



Since: Jun 15, 2011
Posted on: November 3, 2011 2:00 pm
 

Santo among Hall of Fame's Golden Era candidates

Comparing Brian Downing to Robinson and Santo...that's brilliant.  Real intelligent stuff right there.




Since: Dec 7, 2006
Posted on: November 3, 2011 1:51 pm
 

Santo among Hall of Fame's Golden Era candidates

Comparing Ron Santo to Brooks Robinson is so stupid. Yeah Brian Downing has overall better hitting statistics than Robinson, does Downing belong in the HOF?

Just a few stats, Robinson was an MVP, finished 2nd once and 3rd once in the voting. He was a WS MVP. He was in 18 all star games. In defensive WAR he ranks first all time. Enough!

Santo was a better hitter than Robinson, but that does not make Santo a hall of famer, anymore than it makes Brian Downing one.


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